Tim Macuga joined the QUT Centre for Data Science at the start of 2022 where he expands connections and amplifies research for the Centre and for the Australian Data Science Network.
Before he joined CDS, Tim served as Media and Communications Officer for the ARC Centre of Excellence for Mathematical and Statistical Frontiers (ACEMS). There, he led the creation of all the content for news on the Centre’s website, social media, and YouTube channels. He also produced the ACEMS podcast, The Random Sample.
Prior to moving to Australia in 2014, Tim spent nearly 30 years in television news production and management in the United States. The last 20 of those years, serving as a Producer and then Executive News Producer for the FOX-TV affiliate in Phoenix, Arizona.
+Full Transcript
John Bailer
Hey Stats and Stories listeners. Don't forget to get your vote in by the end of the month for our 300th Episode data visualization contest. Last month, I was lucky to attend the 64th World Statistics Congress hosted by the International Statistical Institute in Ottawa, Canada. While I was there, I was able to talk to a number of amazing statisticians, data scientists and journalists for the show, first of whom was former TV journalist turned science communicator Tim Macuga. Macuga helps researchers at the QUT center for data science and Australian data science network tell their stories. Let's start now. And don't forget, once again, to vote on our 300th Episode contest at statsandstories.net/voting. It is my pleasure to be at the International Statistical Institute World's Statistics Congress. And I'm joined by Tim Macuga, Senior Project Officer for the Center for data science, Queensland University of teaching in Brisbane, Australia. But previously, he was the executive news producer for Fox TV, Phoenix and affiliate of the network. Tim, thank you so much for taking the time to chat.
Tim Macuga
Thank you, John, it's good to see you again.
John Bailer
It is a distinct pleasure. I mean, it's so fun to be able to see three dimensional images after only experiencing two for the past four years or so. So help us, sort of a general listener, understand what a news producer does?
Tim Macuga
Okay, so the news producer is in charge of determining what stories go in a newscast, in what format they're going to go into newscast, what the reporters are going to do on an individual day, what stories they're going to work on. So essentially, we look at all the stories and decide that stories with a reporter, maybe that one's not. And then we work with the reporters throughout the day and make sure the story is what we thought it is or if it isn't, what it is now. Is it still a story? So we're having conversations throughout the day, but essentially, the producers are in charge of then laying out that whole newscast, making sure it times out and then executing that newscast, making sure that everything gets written. So the producers do a good chunk of the writing as well. And so as executive producer, I oversaw a team of producers, as well as reporters, so I would work with them as well. So it was a full on day, I often dealt with multiple newscasts and multiple producers.
John Bailer
Okay, so you had a time slot on television that you were targeting here. Yes. So that's unforgiving in terms of timing.
Tim Macuga
It is so unforgiving, John, in fact, I still have dreams where I'm doing the five o'clock news. And it's four o'clock, and I haven't started it. So it's still, I've been out of TV news for nine years now. But I did it for almost 30 years. So it's still very much ingrained in me and it is very much time driven. And, I'm having to get used to working in academia, where meetings don't quite start on time and things like that. So it's been a real culture shift for me.
John Bailer
Yeah, the one thing that we found with being able to do podcasts, you know, you've got a little bit of, you know, you don't have to, stop on the dime, at 530 and go to something else. So that's a really interesting question about telling a story with constraint. So were there certain things that you did to tell a story, given some of the constraints of time that you encountered?
Tim Macuga
Well, you really have to focus on what's the most important thing, the story, because in TV, oftentimes, our reporters had a minute and 10 seconds to a minute and 30 seconds to tell a story. And, so they're coming back with, obviously, videotape, that's five, six, or ten times as much, and they have to edit that down. So it's a real art to pick out what is interesting and important. And make sure you get that right off the top. And that's one of the messages when I tried to work with researchers that you got to get to the get to what you anticipated.
John Bailer
Next question. You know, I was trying to think about how many of my colleagues could get to the point, you know, get to a minute and 10 second point. I mean, it can be hard because we want to say, well, but on the other hand, these are some of the constraints or assumptions that I'm making to do this. So when one of the researchers comes to you and says, you know, hey, we want to push this out as a press release or talk about the research that we're doing in a way that's broadly accessible. What are some of the ways that you help them? Focus down to that minute 10 Minute 30
Tim Macuga
There's two things you want to determine: what's the most important thing. But you also want to determine: is there some conflict involved? So, what is the, “but we know this and we know this, but we don't know this or but this is going on”? And therefore, my research is going to do this. So it's called the end. But therefore I'm not the first. I certainly didn't create it, it was created years ago. But I do try to show people how to do that. And so it's really important that you tell people what we know. But there's a problem here. And that's why my research is important. So it's important not to tell them just what's important. But also what got us here? What is the problem, the conflict that we're trying to resolve?
John Bailer
Why should you care? Why, why should you? Why should your attention among the host of things that are out there? Why should you pay attention to this?
Tim Macuga
It’s how they do movie trailers, you know, if you think about it, in a world that is hidden, and then they bring up some conflict. So it all comes down to you. You have to provide a narrative. You have to give, you want to draw people in with a story, you just can't give them the facts. And it's a big thing about science communication, is that if you're going to, you have to meet the audience where they are, and the audience wants a good story. They don't necessarily want just the facts.
John Bailer
Yeah, so if you were going to advise people helping statisticians, data scientists, the general scientific community, if you had one piece of advice, to launch them on, on better communication of what they do, what might that be?
Tim Macuga
Do it and do it as much as you can, and do interviews to whatever you can, what you need to do is get your message out there, and then start honing it. Because you're never going to get it right out of the gates. So communication is really an art. And if you don't practice it, when the time comes, when it's time to do it, you're not going to be ready. So my advice is just start doing it. Figure out what works for you, find your voice, and just go from there. And then there are a lot of good people like you and others out there who are doing good science communication, who can then say, hey, why don't you try this, but unless you start on that journey? It's not going to work. So that really is my message.
John Bailer
Oh, that's great advice. I mean, no one would expect to be able to do modeling after just encountering one model. They don't necessarily understand how things work until they do it. So why would you expect communication to be easier?
Tim Macuga
And it's really important. I believe that you have that. I think statisticians and data science are learning a lot of good technical skills, but they're not learning the communication skills. And that it's so important that if you can't tell your science, talk about your science, and tell people why it's important and why it matters, then, almost, why are you doing it? So I just wish the science community overall would kind of ingrain the communication as somehow part of this process when we're educating PhD students or any students.
John Bailer
Yeah, that is a great point. I mean, I think in terms of outcomes, effective communication of the work that you do, is one that we should expect, prepare people to succeed in and help evaluate as people start doing this. So if you're speaking to me, I think I'm starting to figure out this podcasting thing after about 300.
Tim Macuga
Yes, no, it's every time, every time you know, I'm the same way. I didn't interview people, you know, I was behind the scenes in the TV station. So interviewing people is a new skill for me. So like you said, with each podcast, I feel like I get a little bit more comfortable doing it. But getting back to getting down that road there. Even now with social media and things like that. There's so many opportunities for you to be able to get your message out on your own without having to rely on anyone else. And that's another thing I encourage people to do. I know social media is not everyone's thing. But if it's done right and effectively, you can build yourself a nice audience and so that when you do publish a paper audience, they're telling you.
John Bailer
Thank you for taking this time. This has been great. Stats and Stories is a partnership between Miami University's Department of Statistics and media, journalism and film and the American Statistical Association. You can follow us on Twitter, Apple podcast, or other places where you can find podcasts. If you'd like to share your thoughts on our program, send your email to statsandstories@miami.oh.edu or check us out at statsandstories.net and be sure to listen for future editions of Stats and Stories, where we discuss the statistics behind the stories and the stories behind the statistics.